community jury is 51% fake

[atscruise]

yes dis communtiy court is 51% fake.

is always reverts backa negative reply to der dear sellers with exactly 51% votes.

i had bought an Nokia Bh214 bluetooth head set with ITEMnO. 180535309185. which was delivered by ONESTOPJUPITER .i found headfone fake and gave the due feadback OF negative.

and den the big EBAY_DRAMA started. i had specifically writen in my comments dat the headfone is fake and even gave proffs.i m still willing to give an AFFIDAVIT over dat.but wat dis sellers very own community court has done is joke. de haven't relied to my comments and simply gave pass to that fraud ONESTOPJUPITER

my only intension for the feeadback dat i had given was to make new buyer of that product to be aware of of the Discrepancies in the product delivered.i never said that ONESTOPjUPITER BE BLOCKED OR PENALIZED.

i think ill be going to Consumer court now.ILL drag dis evil practice of Ebay to SAVE der fraud sellers just to make few more bucks by cheating innocent and negligent consumers.

Ebay is befooling consumers in the anme of OEM products and citing the reason for the product to be not similar to the one in market as , "its imported from some other country. there they have dis model dat we have provide"

u morons

[and-also]

Yes same as item not as described cases, currently they have a private resolution centre open,

So all the -ve feedbacks and neutral, for nonsense kind of reasons,should go through a filter mechanism before they can be posted, and if the -ve feedback is removed by the court, only the ratings should get different , the -ve comment should remain.

Its a logical and good way, in this way buyers will feel happy that their feedback remained, and as sellers we are open for CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM which help us GROW, as is with MICROSOFT or APPLE, the buyers still buy products from them , even theough they know, microsoft products, will crash, are prone to viruses and hacking, and Also apple followers are ready to accept the signal loss in iphone 4 and invest extra in buying iphone 4 bumpers, as they understand none of the companies are perfect, and all are evolutionary as the entire human community, the utter perfection can only be strived for and dedicated the life for , but no one can achieve.

Thus all in all a good idea. to make -ve or neutral feedbacks, a more constructive criticism kind instead of pitting the sellers, against the buyers, let the buyers be forced to go through a resolution system, before posting a-ve feedback.

And on community courts removal of the -ve feedback, let if someone wants, to see the results, the names of the jury be hidden, but reasons, quoted by them for that particular case, be open for the anyones perusal.

That is a good thing, and will make the system , more friendly and tansparent.

[and-also]

And for this original thinking of keeping the comments as contructive criticism, and allowing to see the jury judgements for ruling the case.All DUE credits to @Ratan Sir, 🙂

Always knew ratanji had an out of the box thinking, only thing we required some polishing for presentation of ideas, and logical flow, which i think after his sabbatical he has worked good on the same.

Only thing to think out of the box, now and be neutral in suggesting changes to the system, he should, forget his past dealing with one vendor, which i know was nightmarish, but believe me sir, we all have one bad experiences in our life of all the things, that does not mean we start criticising the entire group of people or system,If we get few rogue buyer, we are not gloomy or cynical about the all good buyers, which we have met and enjoyed dealing with. Hope you will continue your out of the box thinking process, which does not get prejudiced by your past 1 vendor experience. 🙂 good going ratan.trade,Welcome back.

[ratan.trade]

@Berrynxt4u:
While there are many decent people on eBay, there are others that are not so decent. Some are dishonest, some may be honest but don't know how to behave.

I don’t consider your long clarification was lengthy. I appreciate; you spare your valuable time to explain the whole transaction system, process flow and role of eBay Court to maintain check and balances. Out of all, few points are vital to rethink for all including eBay R&D & Process control team, Considering the difficulties of genuine sellers, who are penalized for irresponsible act of buyers and vice-versa, It not matter here, buyers or sellers are genuine or not, or if sellers start posting their grievances about rogue eBay buyers, the Entire forum page will fall short. Most important is, to find out the loopholes of current system, which allow buyers as well as the sellers to utilize the tool(s) for destabilize the process flow and the personal attack or slang starts in this forum and otherwise. Don’t you think the few process or tools of current system should alter or modify to restrict such type of liberty? It is difficult for anyone to indentify the member is genuine or not? But It is very much possible to reduce such destabilizing act by re-engineering the current system.

I have had always non prejudicial view on my case, it seems my expression was. Believe me, I did not find any problems with all sellers other than two cases. The sellers I dealt with, few are exceptionally good like linusstudio (taken your name as you are active here), few are good and few have defaulted in timeline in delivery too, but they explanations were genuine to my understanding. I must appreciate that all sellers are fare, attentive, responsive, reciprocal, serious and excellent behavior in their dealings.

Sir I like to share little about two dealing seller, one of them called up very next day after closing of bid to advise me don’t pay immediately, pay after seven days, because item is costly and it will be shipped after 10 days as seller needs time to prepare the item as per my specification. Though I paid immediately and got the item as he told me. Believe me, I didn’t call the seller till receipt of item, infect, seller use to call me alternate day to update the position. Another case, the seller confirmed the shipment with tracking no and assured me for quality of item. After that very next moment he requested me to leave positive feedback as he requires few positive feedbacks to upgrade their rank, immediately. Indeed, I left the positive feedback on his verbal commitment and seller honored his commitment. Trust me; I am positive person.

The reason of selfish expression was not that I being cheated and also being treated badly by one seller. I was furious and upset because the eBay Court was discarded –VE feedback without analyzing the facts of the case. It was straight-line denial from seller for shipment of item upon seller’s confirmation of receipt of payment. I have clearly explained during judgment process with the explanation of eBay security team (against seller). Seller’s behavior was the act of individual but the removal of –VE feedback was the insult by eBay bodies. I personally give lot of importance to the decision / policy etc of any bodies rather than individual. Therefore, any bodies should act natural rather balancing act. That was my concern.

At close of my issue, I ASSURE you and the concerns to this forum, I will not come across in this forum with any of my personal issue.

Nothing personal just to continue the debate in constructive framework:
In principle, eBay Court may have strong strategic overtones for disputes, but for juries’ side, the focus is one; balance, balance and more balance. It may have CHECK AND BALANCE instead of CHECK THE BALANCE.

With reference to all your posts in this thread, indeed I highly impressed and convinced from your Check and Balance argument but not convinced and agree with the Check and Balance Process. In my view the process should alter and modify by Process Control Owner i.e. eBay R&D Team, eBay Strategy formulator, eBay Analyst and eBay other department, who are involved to regulate the process of this Portal. I suggest few re-engineering in the process of current eBay trading System:

CHECK & BALANCE Process: It should read as separately Check Process and Balance Process not Check and Balance Process. Analyze and extract the process and elements of Current system, spread all process and elements and redraw the eBay Trading System:

I am taking only few process and element in re-engineering the current eBay system:

Process
1. Check Process
2. Balance Process
3. Member Joining process
4. Feedback Process
5. Dispute Resolution Process
6. Security and Resolution Process

Elements
1. eBay buyers
2. eBay Sellers
3. eBay Community Court Juries
4. eBay Security and Safety Team
5. Natural & -VE feedback



I am taking only one sub-element in my argument that is
The eBay Court Jury strength,

I. Target of Current System:
In current system juries involved in only BALANCE Process. There is null involvement of juries in CHECK Process and any other process. That is the main reason Juries are the sole element of controversial debate.

II. Target to achieve during re-engineering: In my View juries roll is more important and it should in CHECK Process, therefore, Juries should allow in CHECK Process to express their views through decision tools.

The decisions of juries should use as factors, in BANALCE Process to drive the final conclusion through artificial intelligence mechanism.

This is just the initial reference to continue this debate. Indeed, I will elaborate this re-engineering debate and benefits of the system, only on positive endorsement of members of this forum to continue this debate further.

Sir, I will appreciate, if you can guide me with your views from your experiences.

Regards RATAN.TRADE

[and-also]

Ratan Sir, my self am very from humble education Backgrounds,and have struggled to pass through the education system, thus please be advised to post across your thoughts with conslusions, and plain non-management book style language, non-theoretical,but practical, which can be 100 percent implemented, as if we come up with good strong suggestions, here that will help chisel out the eBay future systems, which will be more harmonious for Buyers and sellers, as currently to decrease their Policing work, they have policies where, Buyer and sellers themselves both are pitted against each other, which leads to animosity and consfusion leading to disputes.

Recently some nut buyers have posted neutral feedbacks, on my id, ,even mailed TnS for the neutral feedback, having just "OK" as the comment and chased the buyer on phone and mails, but he is least bothered to change it, and says everthing is Proper but for a 59rs Free shipping card reader, what more can he give then NEUTRAL OK, this is his explanation, and tells us we should sportingly take neutrals as that will help grow our business, Well now Explain this all HOOPLA here to him, why has eBay kept neutral feedback, when its akin to negative feedback in Seller Non performance policy is really a big question mark ????

And how to explain such Buyers not to leave neutrals when everthing is proper is again a big question mark, another buyer left a neutral we called him up, he had purchased a 389rs fm transmitter, we asked him why did he leave it, he said, that we wants a free AA battery cell which are not providing with it, then he is ready to remove the same 😞 , now well here what are we supposed to do, heed to such Extortionists demand or leave happy with neutral and probable SNP, again the same buyer for a activation card has posted a neutral when asked why for the same, he says, its costly , Then why the heck did he Buy it, and then claim its costly leaving a neutral feedback,The system of neutrals is really flawed.Can some sellers help ,how to remove "OK" neutral as TnS is not heeding , saying requires Testimonial from Buyer, and the buyer is least concerned , we even are ready to give him full refund, but even then he laughs and says, Grow up neutral is ok, Learn to face it, Such buyers, are really nuts, and drive us crazy too.

if any fellow sellers on forum have any solutions to such buyers please help,Otherwise eBay should come up with some system to block such feedbacks, or community court should allow now even neutrals to be appealed, as Good sellers, are getting the hit of stupid neutrals.

[linusstudios]

@ Ratan.Trade

I am obliged by the honor you have bestowed.

For all buyers I have a tool. Which you can always use to see how a seller has feedbacks for a particular item. In the link below you enter seller id. Some keyword from item title and the time frame. You get to see the feedbacks that seller has received for those items.

In the link below you can see all the feedbacks my id- linusstudios has received in last 90 days for the keyword "tommy wallet".

http://toolhaus.org/cgi-bin/item-fb?User=linusstudios&as_Seller=Seller&Limit=90&Skip_S=on&Search=tommy+wallet&Check=Check

My point of putting this link here in this discussion.- A little research before you purchase can save you from bad buying experience. By the way that website can be used for checking Bad Points( which eBay uses for putting SNP), so sellers can explore a bit more in that link.

Hope it helps.

[and-also]

@linus is TnS helping you to remove lame Neutrals like Ok, Not Bad, Good,Okeyyy and such neutrals posted without any particular reason ??? As we tried before they used to oblige, nowadays they are not heeding, r only we facing such issues or all sellers.

@linus also what do you think about neutrals to be allowed in community court,

The feedback screening mechanism as put forth by by, you, ratan.trade, and also had head takgye on the same, is a great concept, eBay pinks Please do think over it, and take this thought to the policy makers, As it wil save the heads of a few more good sellers, from the guillitone.

And also the load on Court will lessen, the animoisity between the Buyer and seller will lessen, as then eBay will force each other to have dialogue, rather then currently its forcing each other to lock their horns and quarrel by way of Premature -ve and neutral feedbacks, and also comunity court.

To fine tune the entire system a screening mechanism is must, also Please allow neutrals also to becontested in the court, or give them a weighted balance of 1:10 against the negative feedbacks, So 10 neutrals equivalent to 1 negative.

[ratan.trade]

Multiple Members accounts linking through IP:

Each of email ID enables you to create eBay ID, there are no restriction for one person having multiple eBay ID. There is absolutely no problem with sellers (or buyers) having more than one eBay account ID so long as all the accounts are kept in good standing and are used properly.

It is impossible for other eBay users to work out whether seller or buyer has multiple accounts or a single account.

eBay thinktank should introdure a process linking those multiple account ID and use this decision tool to redress the dispute resolution, -VE feedback and neutral feedback controversy.

HAPPY DIWALI TO ALL RATAN.TRADE

[linusstudios]

@ berrynext

They are still removing neutral/neg feedbacks with positive comment like- Good, fine satisfied..

I had asked for allowing of neutrals in CC long back about 7 months but who listens here. All sellers in here come in open only when some thorn pricks them. Else who cares.

@ Ratantrade -
eBay already has this linking procedure. But in India linking by ip is not always possible as here we all have dynamic ip's which are always changing once you restart modem. So eBAy is using Mac addresses of systems also to link accounts.

By that All sellers multiple ids are linked and they suspend all in case of any serious violation in any one. They should do same for tracking buyer ids also.

[kmohanram23]

I got an item through Paisapay claimed to have been made in Germany from Mumbai. On receipt I found it to be fake made locally. It was damaged too. I sent mails to the seller to receive no reply. I have raised a claim under "item not as described" E-bay customer care asked me to return the item within 3 days and I did so. I left a negative feedback which was referred to the community court. This was the feedback I left "Item not made in Germany. I received it damaged. Seller doesn't respond to mails" I sent copies of mails to the seller who argued that I never contacted him. I sent solid proof of my mails to the court (!). The pathetic part of the whole story is this:
"The Community Court has decided that the feedback for this transaction should be removed with a majority of 51% of the votes.
eBay TnS will be acting on this outcome shortly.
Thank you for your participation". How can that be unless it is manipulated? The whole thing left a bad taste in my mouth. So much so for the community court. I cant understand how these erratic sellers manage to get negative feedback removed..always 51% against.

[vkrm2000]

1)"eBay Buyer Protection" / "Paisapay Protection" / "Paisapay Customer Support" / "eBay Guarantee" ("If not satisfied with your purchase on eBay, we will replace or refund your entire amount (including shipping) within 20 days") etc.,,,,, all are FARCE.
2)The only thing is COLLUDING 'eBay' with Sellers and cheating the Buyers. 'eBay' has lost credibility and became biggest cheating portal. I suggest all online buyers not to prefer online buying for the items costing more than Rs 500/-(By following this our loss can be limited to 500 and a lot of harassment can be avoided)